Remembering the legacy of UnitedHealthcare CEO Brian Thompson. Claim denial rates by Insurance Companies.

[tenderfoot]

Last edited Wed Dec 4, 2024, 08:07 PM - Edit history (1)

[BannonsLiver]

1. I'm not going to lose a wink of sleep over what happened.

[LiberalArkie]

57. Karma

[Aristus]

2. I wish all the CEO's now worried about getting a bloody hole in the head

would start increasing the rate of claim approvals.

But the greed is just too strong.

Every single one of these useless fuckwits wants to die the richest person on the planet.

[underpants]

6. Denzel made a movie about this 22 years ago

John Q. is a 2002 American thriller drama film written by James Kearns and directed by Nick Cassavetes. It stars Denzel Washington as the title character, a man who is forced to take a hospital emergency room hostage in order for his son to receive a heart transplant. Robert Duvall, James Woods, Anne Heche, Kimberly Elise, and Ray Liotta appear in supporting roles.

[markpkessinger]

48. We don't even yet know who the gunman was . . .

. . . .let alone what his motive was. So it's a bit premature to say that a movie made 22 years ago is "about this."

[underpants]

61. I was commenting on what the poster had said not in this shooter's motive

[maxrandb]

72. The French made a Revolution about this 230 year ago. NT

[dchill]

53. They'll just hire more security...

...and pay for it by increasing the premiums on those whose claims they will continue to deny. It's just business.

[underpants]

62. There are two things insurance companies hate to do

Take risk and pay claims.

Old saying about insurance. Unfortunately that IS what they do.

[dchill]

83. You know it. That's why I hate it when our government of/by/for...

...the people sells their responsibilities out the back door to the highest donors.

[MontanaMama]

68. As a lifelong self insured person

Your post speaks to me. I have spent decades fighting insurance corporations for benefits to which I am entitled but are routinely denied.

[Aristus]

87. I have spent entire days on the phone trying to get an insurance company

to reverse a denial, or just stop dragging their feet on an approval.

They have denied a suspected MS patient an MRI.

They have denied dialysis coverage for a patient in end-stage renal disease. (Fortunately, his diagnosis automatically qualified him for full state coverage. But he paid his premiums to the private insurer. He should have been approved.)

They have denied a woman with bilateral traumatic below-the-knee amputations an electric wheelchair.

The list goes on and on.

Hope today’s incident inspires an increase in claim approvals.

[sarisataka]

3. Oh, I see

I guess that justifies murder. Things are going to be really interesting if that is the new standard.

[BannonsLiver]

5. Who said it justifies it?

[sarisataka]

12. Nope, no one is justifying it

But if it makes CEOs sit up and change policies it's not a bad thing, right?

[BannonsLiver]

14. Doubtful that happens

Wouldn’t be the way I would handle it, in any case.

[Elessar Zappa]

8. Who said that?

Not mourning his death is not the same as justifying murder. I’m against the death penalty but I don’t mourn their deaths. Same thing here.

[sarisataka]

16. There are quite a few "not mourning" with glee

Several suggestions that it may ripple through executives if they feel at risk, so an assassination isn't all bad.

I have only seen one explicit suggestion that this be the first killing of a CEO. So far.

[Elessar Zappa]

19. I'll put it this way.

I don’t care that he was killed. I feel bad for his family but the death of a greedy asshole who’s likely responsible for thousands of deaths doesn’t keep me up at night. That said, murder is murder and whomever killed him should be prosecuted.

[Seinan Sensei]

56. The Law of the Land should be that Insurance Execs MUST carry the same insurance they sell

The minimum package
Can't buy other insurance
Can't use their own (gazillions of) dollars for their own medical care
And when Execs apply for benefits or hospital admission, they MUST get accepted/denied as per the same metric as all those "covered" by the minimum package
That way, Execs and their families can live and die at the same rate as minimum-coverage people

There. Fixed it.

It's no longer "murder"
It's no longer "assassination"
It's just making tough decisions
It's just doing bid-ness the good ole-fashioned way

[Upthevibe]

70. sarisataka............

My late brother worked for Enron. He lost a lot....especially since so much of what he had was in Enron stock. He had worked for Enron before they were even Enron (They were called Houston Natural Gas) immediately upon graduation from University of TX when he was only 26. My brother and most of the other employees knew nothing about what was happening. He had to sell his house and move into a garage apt.

Fortunately, he had diversified a little and was able to live on what he had until his death in 2015 (14 years after Enron collapsed in December, 2001).

Ken Lay (the CEO of Enron) died of a heart attack in 2006 a few months after he was found guilty. My sister and I are convinced he simply stopped taking his heart medication. What he and the others (Jeffrey Skilling, Andrew Fastow, J. Clifford Baxter, a few more) did was unconscionable. Baxter ended up taking his life in January, 2002.

I have NOT one ounce of empathy for these sociopathic CEO's who literally ruin people's lives and/or are responsible for other people's deaths - like CEO's of insurance companies who deny claims thereby resulting in deaths.

There's a really good (albeit heartbreaking) movie based on a John Grisham book, The Rainmaker. Watch it and then see how sorry I feel for this motherfu**er who was murdered today.

(Sorry so long...I just needed to get this off my chest and this is a good place)...

[Happy Hoosier]

81. So what?

I can feel no sorrow for the death of shitty people without advocating their murder.

If someone killed Trump tomorrow, I'd celebrate the fucker's demise, because he is a blight on this nation. But that doesn't mean I'm actually advocating for his death.

[mvd]

71. Exactly

I’m against the death penalty but many on death row are awful monsters so I don’t really mourn. I just don’t think it’s the right answer. This CEO’s death won’t change United Health and I don’t want this to happen. To me it is just another senseless killing.

[OMGWTF]

25. Insurance companies commit murder by spreadsheet.

[Escurumbele]

47. That should be a bumper sticker. Short and to the point. Well done.

[Hope22]

34. The new standard is 34 felonies, rape,

Bathrooms full of secret documents, millions of dollars for 2020 pardons, grifting family in the WH, Impeached twice…election interference...and on and on! The new standard has people fried and desperate. Those who have been following along have carried a load since 2007 when TSF started in as Birthers, a hateful, racist effort to undermine an election. People are sick and tired of all of it. As for the insurance guy…I think it relates back to three failed assassination attempts on Donald. It’s weird how when someone wants someone dead they know where to shoot. But earwig to the lobe, snakes in the grass and whatever the third one was…appear to be shear theater to sway the voters. People are sick and tired of all of it. Any other decade and the result out here might have been different but remember, within the DU population over 20 years many have had first hand experience of loved ones dying at the hand of insurance corporations. Their first reaction may not be their best.

[Iggo]

43. I'm mad at murder. I'm mad at gun culture.

I’m not shedding a tear for that piece of shit CEO, though.

Walking.
Chewing gum.
No problem.

[EYESORE 9001]

44. I see no evidence of your claim in the OP

Please enlighten us. The ‘justifies murder’ part? That’s on you. I see it as motive, perhaps, and the stats don’t look good for UHC.

Your post infuriates me to no end. It’s part of a trend I’ve seen here since the election - a meanness and willingness to call out those with whom one sees a moralistic failing. I’ve grudgingly started coming around here after the initial shock wore off, and I don’t like what I’m seeing. I will inform all & sundry that the site has become a travesty lately. If I have no better use of my time than picking fights with random people on the internet, then I have no imagination whatsoever. This isn’t a GBCW post. Youse ain’t gettin’ rid o’me so easilee, you see. I’ll still avail myself of the amazing news aggregation here, but I sure as shit will disengage from discussion forums that resemble Monty Python’s ‘Argument Clinic’.

My time is valuable to me - and now more so than ever. I decided to take a break from activities and catch up on news. I didn’t come here to see public scolding - quite misplaced IMO, seeing not a scintilla of proof that anyone is justifying this killing. I’ll take my news without the judgey stuff.

[sarisataka]

49. I am sorry to infuriate you

I try to make people think. It can be uncomfortable to self-reflect but I do not try to anger people.

Note I did not claim the OP was justifying the murder. However if you have not seen "a scintilla of proof that anyone is justifying this killing" I can only say you haven't looked. There are plenty justifying it and some suggesting it should not be the last case.

If it is mean to point out when progressives are failing to live up to their stated values, I suggest you put me on ignore. I will not sit quietly if we choose to act just like that we claim to abhor.

[EYESORE 9001]

51. Done

[Hassin Bin Sober]

73. It doesn't justify murder. But it DID cause me to cancel the candles I ordered on Amazon for the vigil.

[Mike 03]

4. Thanks for posting this. Is UnitedHealth one of the corporations

that uses AI to justify rejections? Thom Hartmann discussed this a couple of months ago and I cannot remember which companies he named. I just think that is a hideous practice. A human being never looks at the claims!

[Dennis Donovan]

7. It's them

CBS News - UnitedHealth uses faulty AI to deny elderly patients medically necessary coverage, lawsuit claims
November 20, 2023

[dalton99a]

20. +1

[gopiscrap]

45. figures

health care should NEVER be a for profit commodity

[whfinlay]

66. Heathcare was not for profit.

Kaiser talked President Nixon into for profit Healthcare. Things have gone downhill since then.

[tenderfoot]

18. A comment on bsky...

If employees of United put dependents who are eligible for coverage elsewhere on their United health insurance plans, they have to pay extra.

No, really. It's true.

So the list of suspects is now: everyone insured OR employed by United

[Jimbo S]

65. That policy is not uncommon

[tenderfoot]

67. That may well be but it is total BULLSHIT

eom

[dflprincess]

23. They denied claims at a high rate when peo people still reviewed them

AI just makes it easier.

[jfz9580m]

26. That's horrible- you should never have anything important

That never sees human intervention.

[montanacowboy]

9. Remember

John Grisham’s novel The Rainmaker

[Johnny2X2X]

10. This man killed people for money

That's what his job was. Kill and bankrupt people to get rich.

[leftstreet]

17. +1

[Johnny2X2X]

86. I'm sure they protect themselves from the reality of their decisions

But deep down, guys like this CEO know that they're looking at a family losing their precious child and weighing it against their deisre to havve a new deck built on their 5th home and choosing the deck. In fact, they're choosing the deck over the lives of hundreds of kids if that's what it takes.

That's the level of evil the US Health Care system foments.

[vanamonde]

85. +2

[Irish_Dem]

11. UHC has been the worst for many decades.

Was a part of managed care wiping out mental health providers.

Denying legitimate claims, legally guaranteed by the state and employers.
But no one would force UHC to pay those claims.

So now there is a serious shortage of qualified mental health providers thanks to
companies like UHC.

[berksdem]

13. I work from one of those companies

and it is unreal and sad. We are making bigger profits than ever and laying off mass amounts of people. Meanwhile the rich get richer with their bloated salaries, stock comp and golden parachutes. I see it every single day...

[yardwork]

15. NC launched a Medicaid managed care model several years ago.

United came charging into NC, competing for one of the state Medicaid contracts. They gave away groceries to Medicaid recipients, funded community outreach programs, gave a lot of grants and gifts to local not-for-profits.

After they got one of the contracts they started denying so many claims, many hospitals and health care systems in NC stopped accepting UnitedHealthcare patients.

That phenomenon is spreading to the Medicare managed care plans now.

It's vulture capitalism. These companies swoop in and make big promises. Then, when they get the contracts, they deny claims and walk away with big profits. The patients suffer. Hospitals close. It's a disgrace.

I don't think the solution is to assassinate CEOs and we have no idea what happened here, but I'll say this... I'm sick of billionaire sociopaths and their rampages. They're destroying our country.

[littlemissmartypants]

28. Hear! Hear!

❤️

[Beck23]

30. Don't get cancer if you have one of these Medicare 'Advantage' plans

Stay on original Medicare with Medigap.

[XanaDUer2]

76. My 61-yr-old sister informed me

Her work offers UHC and she's never had a problem. She barely uses it beyond annuals. I told her she's lucky and I hope that keeps up

[Baitball Blogger]

21. The smoking gun.

[rampartd]

22. good to know

my wife has "peoples health" one of several unite health companies.

[JPK]

27. There are so many guns

Not just pistols but long range hunting rifles, that would be impossible to defend against. At some point you are vulnerable and a determined assassin will find a way. You don't have to be next to them. You could be a block away if not further to die from lead poisoning.

[Beck23]

29. I read that Dr. Oz owns 550k worth of shares of United Healthcare

No wonder he wants everyone to be forced to buy Medicare Advantage. He wants 20% of your paycheck to go to one of these companies instead of the current 1.45% that currently goes to the Meficare Trust Fund.

This, added to the Social Security deduction (currently about 6%) and federal tax (usually 25%"+ for middle class workers) will work a real hardship on the average worker. That looks to me like over 50% deducted from your paycheck in total. This could reduce your take home pay to 45% of your salary.

[lark]

31. Hmm, I wonder what the Humana denial rate is?

They are quite generous with PT compared to Wellcare and they don't drag their feet on auths.

[Beck23]

77. Humana is currently under investigation by Congress for false advertising

[lark]

89. In what way?

Is it because of their deceptive dual eligibility ads? Were those Humana specific? I thought they were just generic Advantage ads, but I don't pay attention because I know about dual eligibility. i worked in medical billing for 20 years so not an average consumer.

I do know that Humana approves my PT immediately and for a long time where Wellcare took forever for any auth. I also know that these companies are cutting benefits, but so far it's just the small stuff plus they added accupuncture this year so I'm happy about that. I also know they may become a bad thing, especially under tsf who hates us and am trying to mentally prepare for the huge expense of regular Medicare. I can't qualify for a subsidy plan, have had too many cancer incidents.

[bmichaelh]

32. Lymphoma survivor

It has been years since I have dealt with UHC.
I have first hand knowledge of the evilness of healthcare companies.

I am a lymphoma survivor; I was first diagnosed in 1990; I am in my third remission.
It returned in 2019.
I tried four different treatments; all failed.
The fifth treatment succeeded.

In parts, due to ACA's ban on lifetime limits, approval of new drug by FDA in 2020, successful appeal of denial of drug by healthcare provider.

Between the third and fourth failed treatments, my mobility had declined so that I required the use of a walker.
Cancer was near my spinal column.
Initially, healthcare insurer approved the fifth drug.
Little by little, mobility increased and I needed the walker less and less.
My healthcare insurer send me a rejection letter that they would not pay for any more treatments.
My healthcare provider successfully appealed.

Further, to show how evil insurers are; if I did not find a solution to my cancer; there was a strong possibility that paralysis would have preceded death.

Currently, healthcare insurers make life and death decision on whether they will pay for this or that cancer drug.
Sometimes, they make a decision that is wrong.

[barbtries]

36. what really sucks imo

is it's the bean counters instead of the doctors who make these decisions. Like Ford keeping the Pinto on the road because they had determined that what they would pay out in wrongful death claims was an acceptable amount compared to what they would lose in profits if they pulled the car off the market.

[gopiscrap]

52. the fuckers who decided that

should have gone to prison

[Beck23]

40. Stay on original Medicare if you can

There are two Medicares. One is original Medicare, and the other is Medicare Advantage.

Original Medicare will never deny a claim. They pay 80%, but you need Medigap insurance to pay the rernaining 20%.

Medicare Advantage companies are private companies that get a certain amount of money from Medicare per patient per year. They are in it for the money and make more money if they deny more claims.

The Republicans put Medicare Advantage in place because they eventually want to totally privatize Medicare, and eliminate original Medicare. You can look to Dr. Oz to finish the job by sending the Medicare deduction from your paycheck to a Medicare Advantage company instead of the Medicare Trust Fund.

[barbtries]

33. I wonder if his death

is a sign of things to come.

the wealth inequality and fucking over marginalized communities is not something that can ever go on forever.

[Evolve Dammit]

35. That is the corp that AARP uses for Medicare.

Glad I didn't select them

[Nixie]

37. Just saw his wife said he had received death threats related to lack

of coverage. Customer related. I just saw this in the Yahoo news page.

"Wife reveals murdered UnitedHealthcare CEO had received ‘some threats’
Thompson’s wife said her husband had recently received threats from angry customers over complaints she believed may have had to do with “a lack of coverage.”

“I don’t know details,” Paulette Thompson told NBC News. “I just know that he said there were some people that had been threatening him.”

Justin Rohrlich reports:"

[gay texan]

58. you reap what you sow n/t

[LeftInTX]

79. I'm sure he did. But that may not have anything to

do with his murder.

[littlemissmartypants]

80. With any luck...

His estate is completely tangled up in paperwork and delays not unlike what his customers deal with and she'll never see a dime of anything.

I'd love to see a few disgruntled customers sue the family based on her admission of difficulty with "lack of coverage" too. She might ought not to have shared that tidbit during an ongoing investigation.

The hubris of these people is nauseating.

[gopiscrap]

38. Fuck Thompson and his family

may he rot in hell. All health insurers and their CEO's are greedy fucking assholes living off of the misery of others. Perhaps in his afterlife he might be for universal health care? If he was in life, he might still be alive right now

[av8rdave]

39. Remember the republican canard about "death panels?"

Our for - profit health “care” system is the epitome of a death panel! Except you don’t even get a panel. Some overpaid @$$hole in a cubicle decides if you live or die when your care gets expensive.

Does this justify the murder? Of course not, unless we believe in an eye for an eye (I don’t).

[33taw]

41. I'd like to see this along side revenue totals.

[Beck23]

42. The CEO salary was in the millions

[33taw]

60. I'm sure. I wondered what their overall annual revenue was compared to the companies that have less denials.

[AdamGG]

46. I was about to renew my United Marketplace plan

I didn't have any problem with the minor claims I had so far. Oscar has horrible rankings/reviews. My mom has a United Medicare supplemental and she has lots of medical issues and they've paid everything.

United did goofy stuff with me like they assigned a PCP to me who is a hospitalist and many of the doctors that they list as being available to take patients actually are not when you call them to check.

I have until December 15th to select my plan for 2025. Do any of you have recommendations for companies that are better? I was going with United because I had a bad fall on my bike a couple years ago and have a bunch of plns and screws in my shoulder and the surgeon who did that is on the United plan, but not on Ambetter. Aetna is another option, but their price and deductible are higher.

My current job doesn't offer insurance and I plan to move that one that does because odds are Trump will end or seriously damage the ACA Marketplace plans.

[haele]

84. Aetna (in CA, at least) is better POS/PPO insurance for the price. But it's still the price.

They also have people that can be reached.
The main problem with all insurance is that each Insurance company has about 50 different plans depending on personal or employer coverage, available network providers, and patient "needs"; likewise, each State has different coverage rules and regulations affecting those plans, the Federal government has different rules and regulations for plans they include across all the Federal programs.
I've got decent Federal employer insurance (A POS/PPO), Tricare, the VA, and now Medicare A&B.
Four insurance plans, three of which I'm paying premiums for, and one (The VA) which will look at whatever might be left and negotiate a lower final payment after treatment on a needs basis.
It's ridiculous the amount of paper or computing my providers and insurance companies will go through just to treat me.
Single payer would take care of a lot of the redundancies and red tape.

Haele

[JoseBalow]

50. Eat the Rich

Good riddance to that greedy bastard

[Diraven]

54. I'm on United Health now

I've been having a lot of stuff done for chronic back problems and they almost always deny my claims initially until I call someone there to explain that no, I still haven't been in an automobile accident. 🙄

[kimbutgar]

55. Wow glad I have Kaiser

I wonder if the shooter was a disgruntled victim of denial healthcare for themselves or a family member.

When they get the shooter it will be interesting to hear their motive.

[Beck23]

78. If you have Kaiser make sure you know which hospitals are in network.

[kimbutgar]

82. Kaiser has its own hospitals

It is a not for profit medical company and the doctors and nurses have shares in the company.

[Joinfortmill]

59. Yikes!

[Jarqui]

63. So his company killed a lot of people by denying medical coverage they desperately needed

Some grieving party appears to have concluded 'an eye for an eye ...'

I wonder how good his bonuses look today ...

If those facts stand, I have little sympathy for him.

[yaesu]

64. Karma is sneaky that way. nt

[Staph]

69. I've had Medicare supplemental insurance, through my former employer, since I turned 65.

After I retired but before I qualified for Medicare, I had Blue Cross/Blue Shield. When my cancer returned the first time, I had severe anemia, with no obvious cause. Because there was blood in my feces, I had both a colonoscopy and endoscopy, but they couldn't find the cause. The doctors wanted to use a camera pill - you swallow it and it takes pictures all the way through your system. BC/BS refused to pay for it. They ended up having to pay for two more week-long hospital stays (including an ambulance ride when I couldn't sit up or stand) and an additional and more extensive endoscopy to finally find the ulcer. I wouldn't wish BC/BS on my worst enemy.

I've never had a claim denied by UHC, even when my cancer returned a third time. Your mileage may vary.

[MuirWoods]

74. Data

There are not a lot of facts to go along with this graphic. However, I will say the following:

Claims can be denied for a number of reasons. There is not any information here indicating the number legit claims that were denied. In an industry this big, there are going to be claims submitted that are complete bogus, and the opposite is true.

Basically implying that his shooting was over denied claims and he deserved it is a reach and not a great reflection of our party

[Cthulu on call]

75. The torches and pitchforks are coming

I have no compassion for this man. He was a tyrant.

[LetMyPeopleVote]

88. These are sickening denial stats

Link to tweet