This country must really be in the crapper for it to idolize a vigilante...

[PeaceWave]

We haven't seen idol worship of ruthless criminals since the Great Depression with Bonnie and Clyde. Is that where we're at now, cheering on those who take the law into their own hands?

[Think. Again.]

1. Yeah, a lot of people are REALLLY going out of their way...

...to sow division.

[questionseverything]

2. The ass used a computer program to deny 90% of claims

Why isn’t the government prosecuting the company for fraud?

[Autumn]

5. He was being investigated for insider trading and fraud. Sens. Elizabeth Warren and Ed Markey

had asked the Securities and Exchange Commission to investigate UnitedHealth for the CEO's stock sales back in April. Insider trading and fraud.

[Silent Type]

9. Nope, it didn't deny 90% of claims or anything close. You misread headlines if

you believe that.

[Jim__]

13. There is a claim that 90% of United Health's denials - based on that algorithm - were reversed on appeal.

I haven't seen how that suit turned out.

From YahooNews

...

One lawsuit filed last year against UnitedHealth claims that 90% of the algorithm’s recommendation are reversed on appeal.

The lawsuit states that UnitedHealthcare wrongfully denied elderly patients care by “overriding their treating physicians’ determinations as to medically necessary care based on an AI model that Defendants know has a 90% error rate.”

In court filings, lawyers for UnitedHealth argued that the lawsuit should be dropped because plaintiffs failed to complete Medicare’s appeals process and that their grievances are with the federal government and not UnitedHealth, STAT News reported in May.

UnitedHealthcare and Humana (HUM) did not immediately respond to requests for comment from Quartz.

...

[dalton99a]

22. And consumers rarely appeal denied claims

For ACA plans:

https://www.kff.org/private-insurance/issue-brief/claims-denials-and-appeals-in-aca-marketplace-plans/

Consumers rarely appeal denied claims and when they do, insurers usually uphold their original decision. In 2021, HealthCare.gov consumers appealed less than two-tenths of 1% of denied in-network claims, and insurers upheld most (59%) denials on appeal.

For Medicare Advantage plans:

https://oig.hhs.gov/reports/all/2018/medicare-advantage-appeal-outcomes-and-audit-findings-raise-concerns-about-service-and-payment-denials/

When beneficiaries and providers appealed preauthorization and payment denials, Medicare Advantage Organizations (MAOs) overturned 75 percent of their own denials during 2014-16, overturning approximately 216,000 denials each year. During the same period, independent reviewers at higher levels of the appeals process overturned additional denials in favor of beneficiaries and providers. The high number of overturned denials raises concerns that some Medicare Advantage beneficiaries and providers were initially denied services and payments that should have been provided. This is especially concerning because beneficiaries and providers rarely used the appeals process, which is designed to ensure access to care and payment. During 2014-16, beneficiaries and providers appealed only 1 percent of denials to the first level of appeal.

[Dyedinthewoolliberal]

32. What would be interesting data to me

would be extrapolating how much it would have cost United to pay each of those denied claims. I'm willing to guess it would not come close to harming their revenue totals. So I'm speculating they are denying claims because they can get away with it, rather than basing decisions on financial impact to them. This would show us how lopsided and un-scrupulous the industry is.

[TheProle]

45. Cite?

The fact that this type of misinformation not only stands here but also has 5 recs is shameful.

[Autumn]

3. What is it trump says? America is a shit hole country. It fits, Crapper, shit hole. Well done

Last edited Wed Dec 11, 2024, 06:30 PM - Edit history (1)

You tied it together

[Hope22]

4. It's all great as long as those rooting for don't get hit.

Just when you think things can’t get shittier!

[Trenzalore]

6. Well before the 1930s

The banks fucked everyone and cost them all their savings.....so people robbing banks didn't trouble people as much.

[Hekate]

28. Wow, kind of like the for-profit health desurance system we have in the 21st century

Most common cause of personal bankruptcy in the US: medical bills — no doubt due to unnecessary treatments.

[ForgedCrank]

7. Na, this is different

because the victim was someone they don't like.
Imagine trying to write code for a program that determines if someone should be forgiven for a crime or convicted, and it has to follow all of the guidelines set forth by these types of things. The computer would instantly lock up and crash due to all of the conflicts.

[republianmushroom]

8. Yup, they elected to president a convicted felon,

and political members of both parties calling for his pardon.

46 months and counting

[Wounded Bear]

10. IDK, 50 years of comic book heros, including 20 years of making movies out of them...

[Mike 03]

11. The "Vigilante" is a classic American archetype that "we" have celebrated

for centuries in our literature and cinema and real life.

Many people are experiencing conflicted emotions about this.

This discussion was interesting for a few days but it's getting really tedious.

[Shellback Squid]

12. yeah, and Breaking Bad was good too

[Hellbound Hellhound]

15. This country was formed on vigilantes and has been a part of our lifeblood since inception.

Our founding as a colony was declared by vigilantes. Our revolution was begun by vigilantes. Almost every war before Vietnam was started, fought for and ended by vigilantes. And whats-his-name CEO died at the hands of a vigilante.

He's just one more in a long line of dead ends. In this case, more literal than most.

[ananda]

16. Maybe the Magats need to actually see and live through what they voted for.

It looks like it has to get that bad enough for
real change to happen.

And believe me, it will.

And there will be no exceptions for anybody
whatsoever.

[kerry-is-my-prez]

27. What about the Oligarchs? It will be a battle between Trump and them.

I could see Elon running the country. Who does the right like better: Elon or Donald?

[ananda]

33. IMO, it doesn't matter who runs the country into the ground.

It will have the same result.

[Trenzalore]

36. JD Vance is there if Trump goes off script

Trump is a spokesman. He gets to walk around as they play hail to the chief and go to rallies. He isn't running things.

[Meowmee]

44. Orange psycho- he is the messiah to them, their savior

[Kingofalldems]

17. Idol worship of ruthless criminals you say?

Where is your OP on Donald Trump?

[Shrek]

18. Is this about Daniel Penny or Luigi Mangione? n/t

[Skittles]

31. they are both murderous scum

yup

[peregrinus]

19. Just post a story about a dad killing a child predator

And see how many people jump for joy over the death. A good 50% of the respondents would be saying how they would help the dad get rid of the body or that they’d pull the trigger themselves.

[Prairie Gates]

20. You're right: the for-profit healthcare system is a complete disaster, a historic fuck-up

Capitalism is bad for healthcare. Good point.

[Blue_Tires]

21. Rittenhouse is a celebrity millionaire now...

Then there's Zimmerman.

You're acting like the celebration of vigilantism is a recent phenomenon...

[tenderfoot]

23. cheering on those who take the law into their own hands?

I know right?

You're not fooling anyone.

[Kingofalldems]

25. Boom!

[ShazzieB]

24. Who's idolizing a vigilante?

Perhaps you could direct me to those posts, as I have not seen them.

What I have seen is a lot of people (including myself) admitting an inability to get very worked up about the death of a disgustingly rich CEO who has made a fortune off of denying health care to people. I have also seen a lot of very judgmental responses scolding those of us who have expressed an inability to grieve over this, accusing us of all sorts of terrible things.

I am getting very tired of all of the above. I'm not a fan of murder, but I am also not a fan of being told how I'm supposed to feel about something and being judged harshly for not feeling the way someone else thinks I "should" feel.

I wish people would realize that it is NOT possible to dictate how someone should feel about this or anything else. It's time to be adults and stop judging each other.

[SocialDemocrat61]

26. Well said

[ShazzieB]

35. Thanks!

I am just unbelievably sick and tired of all the judgmental posts I've seen here since that guy was shot. People telling others how to feel and judging people for not responding in an "approved" fashion really grinds my gears.

[SunImp]

40. They are virtue signalling over nothing

Hardly anyone is going "Haha, take that rich guy" People are just frustrated over our current healthcare system.

[canetoad]

38. That's a great post Shazzie

You wrote what I was thinking. Thank you.

[H2O Man]

41. The best response.

Thank you.

[Clouds Passing]

29. Yeah, too many idolizers of dump & co, vigilantes for the 1/10th of 1%

[Skittles]

30. yes

rich scum killing rich scum, NOTHING to admire here

[nini]

34. I don't idolize him, but I certainly have zero sympathy for the victim

The suspect needs to be put away for a longgggg time.

[GenThePerservering]

37. Oh well - how many more threads on this theme?

seems like we've had plenty, pretty much all running to forumla.

[canetoad]

39. Do you remember the scene from 'Amadeus"

Where the Emporer of Austria said, "Too many notes" and Mozart responded with,

"Just as many as are needed".

This is a BFD. It's unprecedented. People need to talk about it. We need to get it all out in front of us. Please don't try to put a lid on discussion.

[republianmushroom]

42. And they named the convicted felon person of the year.

Luigi Mangione may wind up as person of the decade or century.

Damn strange world we live in.

[hatrack]

43. Yes, by all means, keep on putting words in our mouths and thoughts in our brains . . . .

I bow in homage to your awesome rhetorical powers!!!

[Emile]

46. I don't see anyone idolizing CEO Brian Thompson?

[choie]

47. The country has been in the crapper

Since it elected a sociopath in 2016.