General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsClyburn is wrong.
I believe Biden should NOT pardon Trump. It sends the wrong message. While I believe that forgiveness is essential for the person doing the forgiving, I do not believe that a criminal the stature of Trump should get anything but a jail cell.
I was a person involved with national security during my Army days. I was a very small cog in the process, yet I went through all the requirements and received a Top Secret--Crypto clearance. I am beyond furious that Trump has been allowed to get away with what amounts to stealing our nation's biggest secrets, endangering an unknown amount of friendly operatives, and then lying about it to escape the consequences. Goodness knows what he was doing with the documents, but we can guess. If you or I had done that, we'd be serving twenty years this very day.
Pardoning Trump will NOT heal the nation. Speaking only for myself, I feel that I will forever be suspicious of magaty people and repubs. Pardoning tRump would only serve to make me feel that a terrible injustice has been done, and further reaffirm what I feel about two levels of justice being served up to the nation.
We are right now in the middle of a destruction of our country. It's like an aggressive cancer, and it's spreading. You can't say, "Kumbaya," forgive and forget, right when we might be truly facing Civil War 2. And, would you pardon, say, Hitler, in an attempt to heal a nation? No, you'd get rid of that person as soon as you could. I'd like to see ALL of the traitorous part of the Congress locked up. I'm not in the mood for watching that dyed blonde POS tRump walking around free, and continuing to rant on about how awful our country is, and how Dems did this or that.
It's amazing what we've been through. I never thought I'd live to see the day when the richest man in the world is seeking to impose austerity on those that can ill afford to misspend even one red cent. One person, not even elected by Magats. I don't know about you, but every time Musk opens his mouth, I'd like to punch Donald in the face. I do NOT want to see Donald given a pass for insurrection. I know what I saw. He needs to be in jail. I'll settle for exile, or six feet under, as long as it's natural. But, a PARDON? C'mon, that's unreal.
Think. Again.
(18,574 posts)Docreed2003
(17,851 posts)100% agree
Irish_Dem
(58,803 posts)It will embolden them and make their crimes worse and more numerous.
I wish people would do their homework and learn about psychopaths and their behavior.
Before they spout out dangerous ideas about how to handle them.
republianmushroom
(17,943 posts)46 months and counting
Silent Type
(7,133 posts)one can make a case it cost us votes. Every time trump got charged and tried, his approval rating went up.
I respect Clyburn, Biden likely would not have beed elected without him. I dont mind discussions.
W_HAMILTON
(8,535 posts)(Liz Cheney)
And one could just as easily argue -- probably more so, in fact -- that our justice system treating Trump with kid gloves for four years is what cost us the election.
rampartd
(637 posts)they proved that we are "soft on crime."
Silent Type
(7,133 posts)a thing. GOPers in Congress were mad as hell, of course that changed within weeks.
Supremes were ticked to and would have called it an official act.
krkaufman
(13,749 posts)... and not worry about speculating how it might affect the vote of idiots.
BOSSHOG
(40,114 posts)NONE. WHATSOEVER. The potential to be held legitimately to account and punished for wrongdoing is not HARM its justice. And trump wants nothing to do with Justice. Nothing to do with fairness. Nothing to do with integrity. Thats the anthem of the Republican Party. No Justice for us. For Gods Sake No Justice for us.
Meowmee
(5,892 posts)I can't believe anyone is even suggesting this to be honest. I already stopped funding d a long time ago except for candidates I like. But this will be a bridge too far for me, to say the least. It will prove to me they have no courage to fight this at all. In my opinion this is lunacy and is the worst possible thing that could be done regarding this.
Mad_Machine76
(24,780 posts)I was aghast when I heard him talk about Biden pardoning Trump. Trump and others have already greased the wheels for him to escape accountability. Neither Biden nor anybody else should lend him a hand too.
InAbLuEsTaTe
(24,634 posts)Timewas
(2,298 posts)It would be the biggest single mistake made by any politician anywhere any time. And would end any respect he has earned. (at least from me)
CanonRay
(14,901 posts)But this way? Big no.
Trueblue1968
(18,220 posts)Crunchy Frog
(27,072 posts)on the part of the Democratic Party, and would contribute to the narrative that Dump did nothing wrong. It is genuinely the worst possible signal they could send.
It would also serve to alienate a lot of people, myself included. It would likely set the Dems up to be a permanent minority party, there to give the illusion of democracy when there is none. There to go along to get along, maintaining their comfortable positions while the country goes to shit.
This would not be an acceptable move for the party.
He doesn't even need to be pardoned as he is at no risk whatsoever of ever facing any consequences. It would do nothing but give him and his actions a degree of unearned legitimacy
lostnfound
(16,688 posts)AverageOldGuy
(2,138 posts). . . Clyburn's generation needs to move along and get out of the way.
poli-junkie
(1,156 posts)Wake the fuck up Dems!!!
Bernardo de La Paz
(51,081 posts)SCantiGOP
(14,296 posts)I thought it was probably for the best that Ford pardoned Nixon.
But if Nixon had been indicted and convicted, most of Trumps defiant and illegal actions might never have happened, or he might have been held accountable.
DallasNE
(7,579 posts)And repeating a mistake means it will create a tightening spiral until the chain is broken.
Jarqui
(10,497 posts)4 grand juries concluded Trump probably committed the crimes he was indicted for
The federal conviction rate for an indicted person is over 90%
No one should be above the law.
You can pardon for a miscarriage of justice - like Hunter got pardoned for.
You can't use the election because Elon Musk blew $250 mil and the rest of the oligarchs who controlled the media made sure Americans did not get the full accurate facts about Trump before they went to the polls.
You don't pardon someone like that.
You cannot rely on an election outcome obtained the way this one was: with massive deception.
vapor2
(1,585 posts)Pardoning trump would send the message that his crimes are 100% acceptable. AND he will continue to be lawless and continue to grift for the next 4 years.
KT2000
(20,907 posts)he would spend the next week bellowing how weak Biden is as well as all Democrats. He would also make up a reason it was done, such as it was all made up and they didn't want to get caught.
He is a psychopath and should not be trusted with kindness or anything actually.
I remember when he bought a casino from Merv Griffen. Griffen was ill and at the end of his life but that did not stop trump of bragging about screwing Griffen over on the price.
Silent Type
(7,133 posts)legislation on healthcare, childcare, gives citizenship to everyone, climate, SS, etc.
Wed probably have to pick only a couple of those, but still
djacq
(1,672 posts)2:00 minute; "Absolutly Fucking Cowardly Horseshit"
dlk
(12,454 posts)It sends a signal that the desecration of our capitol, the assault on police officers, and on our government was somehow justified.
It would give the nudge, nudge, wink, wink to fascism.
Worst idea ever!!!
PS - appeasement NEVER works!
onecaliberal
(36,203 posts)UTUSN
(72,589 posts)BurnDoubt
(67 posts)Remember when that was a thing? I'm in 100% agreement with anyone who says these were CRIMES and those involved should be serving grievous time, long time, miserable time. The sentences meted out were less onerous than detention, and some convicted were openly arrogant at having slid-by with a slap on the wrist and augmented street-cred for being SEDITIONISTS!--- "You in a heap of trouble, there boy. We'll deal with you after the coup!"--- Without an independent Judiciary we are Fucked. Oligarchy Crime is un-prosecutable under our Constitution as long as the Right Wing can buy the Judiciary. They don't see us.
jalan48
(14,482 posts)JHB
(37,447 posts)Is Trump innocent of the many things he's been accused of? FUCK NO!
So why even suggest a pardon? What kind of donor money has Clyburn been smoking to even suggest this?
FHRRK
(975 posts)And I will Never vote for a Dem again!
Done with this lame ass bullshit, any Dem stating he should be pardoned has lost my vote! The leader of the Party folds then the entire party has folded!
FFS, I cant even believe it is being discussed.
electric_blue68
(18,441 posts)FHRRK
(975 posts)Trying to shame me into voting for those who refuse to fight!
The mother fucking Repukes tried to take away my vote on J6!
I sure as hell aint voting for any person who refuses to hold them responsible, Especially if Trump is pardoned.
I know my enemy.
Hope22
(3,032 posts)I doubt letting T slide is going to help things!
LittleGirl
(8,463 posts)Let 45 try to pardon himself next year. Lets see how that goes over.
Pardon Reality Winner! She served nearly 5 years in prison for one effing document! 45 took thousands of government documents! Wheres is that legal? Only in maga land.
electric_blue68
(18,441 posts)Drumphf is a traitor inciting violence against the legitimate Election of Biden in 2020, against the Capitol Police, The Congresspeople, their staff, the Capitol staff, etc. Taking X hours to tell the people to leave, while looking like he was enjoying himself watching the terrible actions on TV.
As Endless Wire said we. all. saw. it. as it happened, or in later You Tube videos, or the Congressional Hearings replays! 🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬
He needs to be punished in some form, or fashion; not pardened! No way in Hell will this effin' "heal" the country!!! Are you kidding!
He's a scourge now agsinst (however imperfect!) Our Democracy, as the storm clouds of Authoritarianism ride in his wake!
( I've been doing my best to keep my worst anxiety at bay. Doing mostly well, but I expect emotional problems at times once J20 Noon happens.
Otoh, my anger comes, and goes as I read various things happening since the Election. Luckily I have a lot of interests to divert me from anxiety, or anger. But focusing on it here, now...
And, boy, I'm typing this and getting mad. Sort of "yelling" inside my mind. He's just. so. hideous. In so many ways. And he's going to be pResident... again!!!!! Gah! ) 😔
Will go stream some TV soon.
Hope22
(3,032 posts)generalbetrayus
(662 posts)Maybe he and other older Dems suggesting that Biden pardon tRump are trying to avoid having Kash Patel put them in jail for annoying the incoming dick-tator.
bmichaelh
(626 posts)Nothing would be achieved by pardoning Trump.
Trump would not act nice if it happened.
Hillary Clinton attended his previous Presidential inauguration.
But Trump directed his DOJ to find ways to prosecute her, even though she did nothing wrong.
https://apnews.com/article/060ca2399a744b4a9554dbd2ec276a90
From Shakespeare:
MENENIUS
There is no more
mercy in him than there is milk in a male tiger.
--Shakespeare, Coriolanus 5.4.28-29
Some people should realize you should not indulge a sociopath.