I would like someone to explain to me why it is such a big deal to tell

[Maraya1969]

Other people that you are trans. Grant it, I do not know a lot about the subject and the place I am getting my information at is probably not the best, (I'm watching "90 Day Fiance" and its spinoffs)

Like there was a guy who went to Columbia or some South American country to be with a women he fell in love with online and her parents were "conservative" and they made such a big damn deal about him telling the parents that he was trans. I understand that they need story lines and they want friction but damn, why can't he just be who he is without having to tell the entire world as if it is something to be ashamed of??

I've heard that Transsexuality is a birth defect where your body is born incongruous with your brain. One thinks it is male and the other female or visa versa. So you fix it if you can and go on. I've also heard on that show "Botched" that many women are born with 3 nipples and they just remove one of them. These women don't feel the need to tell the entire fucking world that they were born with an extra nipple!

I do not mean to be insensitive to anyone and if I have been I apologise. I wish people could just be and not have a bunch of jerks judge them. If this is a birth defect then it joins a whole bunch of other birth defects that are not judged as character defects, like dyslexia, color blindness, regular blindness, autism, missing limbs etc.

Thank you

[TommyT139]

1. Do you mean

Do you mean a big deal to the person who is trans, or the person who is not tras, learning the information?

[Maraya1969]

4. IDK. I guess the person who is trans because they do not have

to share the information unless there is something that would make it known without them saying anything

[TommyT139]

16. It's complicated

It's complicated, because there are so many different life paths under the one umbrella word "transgender."

It should not matter whether or not there is something that would "make it known," as you say -- whether visually, a gender maker on a driver's license, one's voice, etc. Not everyone can or wishes to take all medical, social, and legal steps to be perceived as "the other gender." Not everyone identifies that way.

But more to the point, imagine trying to go through life without talking about perhaps the most central facet of your identity. That would interfere with friendships, medical treatment, and ...most everything else. Punishing someone, isolating them, denying who they are -- that's a hard way to live, whether the pressures come from outside or from within.

For example, I'm someone who does not have to disclose that I was born female. Most of the time, it's simply not relevant. But if there is a risk that this one fact about me will change how a person relates to me -- ranging from fascinated, to awkward, to deadly -- that is a huge decision.

[unblock]

2. First, it's not a "defect", it just is what it is. People are people and no one fits exactly into simplistic boxes.

Second, 99% of your interaction with people has nothing to do with their gender, orientation, sex, gender expression, etc.

I don't need to know or care about any of this regarding my server at all restaurant or my car mechanic or whatever. It just doesn't matter.

My daughter is trans, and even then, over 95% of our interaction has nothing to do with her being trans. Homework, chores, hobbies, life lessons, etc., everything is the same as it was before she came out, other than occasionally talking about meds and doctors appointments and maybe mom might be more helpful clothes shopping than I would be....

But yes, people who obsess about trans people are... weird.

And they don't believe in freedom -- letting everyone live their own life as they best see fit.

[jfz9580m]

5. Agreed

I don’t get it..
But yes, people who obsess about trans people are... weird.
It is one thing to not go out of your way to be supportive of trans rights (tbh there are so many problems plaguing our planet these days that even I have fatigue re more than casual support of most liberal issues I do honestly support..the breaking of our planet is sort of uppermost on my mind to the exclusion of most everything else increasingly)..but it is really really weird to fixate on trans rights as a threat to your autonomy.

I don’t get these people who can’t let other people be..

[Maraya1969]

7. I should not have labeled it as a "defect" and I am sorry. I realize

that people are born all sorts of ways and no one can say what is the proper way or not.

I am bisexual. I never asked for it and it was hard accepting it but I think that is just me now. If it was supposed to be different it would be.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

3. In one year: "Beaten, Stabbed And Shot: 320 Trans People Killed In 2023 - New Monitoring Report"

It's a big deal because reactions can be lethal, injurious, rights-stripping, depressive & many variations of horrible. People get dropped by friends, family, employers, landlords, and random strangers. People lose jobs, housing, health care, family love, and companionship.

Beaten, Stabbed And Shot: 320 Trans People Killed In 2023 - New Monitoring Report
https://www.forbes.com/sites/jamiewareham/2023/11/13/beaten-stabbed-and-shot-320-trans-people-murdered-in-2023/

[jfz9580m]

9. The active demonization by the right

Has to be a factor in the rise of anti-trans hate crimes.

[TommyT139]

18. It is

Sept 25, NPR
"More trans teens attempted suicide after states passed anti-trans laws, a study shows"

https://www.npr.org/sections/shots-health-news/2024/09/25/nx-s1-5127347/more-trans-teens-attempted-suicide-after-states-passed-anti-trans-laws-a-study-shows

[jfz9580m]

19. 72% rise?

Awful..that is really horrible..

[Maraya1969]

10. I understand that and I believe it. Maybe it is the people who have

not been able to completely transition that are attacked.

That is why I think it is better to get younger people on hormones early before the "other" hormones change the body. I have seen so many pictures of trans people who are just gorgeous and I wonder if it is because they were treated early. Hormones can be a real bitch and they affect the entire body, (saying that as a women who has gone through PMS and one pregnancy)

[Bernardo de La Paz]

21. Think again. People wondering, considering, transitioning, and transitioned are attacked

It doesn't matter if they "pass" (transitioning) or "are" (transitioned).

Transgenders, mixed genders, bisexual, homosexual, non-binary, transvestites, asexual, flamboyant, ... they are attacked.

It doesn't matter if ... anything. They are attacked.

[AZSkiffyGeek]

6. With one party actively using people like me as a scapegoat to win votes

Yeah, it's kind of a big deal. Hell, there are people here who don't think people like me should play sports on teams matching my gender.
I came out to my friends and family two weeks ago. I've received nothing but support from my friends, and nothing but silence from most of my family.

[Maraya1969]

11. I heard once that God gives us friends to make up for our families.

I'm sorry your family is acting like jerks. Hopefully they will come to their senses in the future.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

22. "God" can't be proven and is best not invoked when religious preferences are not explicitly in common

Would it not be better to write "... we get friends ..." or "... we make friends ..." instead of "... God gives us friends"?

Friendship takes positive effort and response and maintenance by both parties. It is not bestowed in an instant forever unchanging.

If "God gives friends", then "God" can and should fix bigotry, prejudice, and extra-judicial violence, especially between family members.

[TommyT139]

26. God bless your heart.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

28. doG (or Ceiling Cat) bless yours. . . . .nt

[IbogaProject]

8. Some are biologically "intersex"

They can either have mixed gonads or their hormones might be altered. I know someone who is female but has a recessive trait that blocks some of the female traits. She is a functioning woman but more masculine. She has advanced training in Biology so she has become an expert. There are others for whom it is more in their brain, they aren't mentally wired for their bio gender. So there are a range of reasons people decide to transition. My friend is fine being a masculine woman so she wouldn't change but is very clear that she is "intersex". Please be polite if I got any of this wrong, I'm just trying to relay what I've learned over the years.

[unblock]

13. i saw a great video by a biologist, maybe it was a tiktok, not sure

he rattled off a ton of examples of things in humans and other species that don't fit easily into the simple male/female dichotomy.

then he summed it up brilliantly: nature just does what it does, in all its wonderful diversity, and then humans come along and try to understand it, making simplifications because we can't readily comprehend all the ways in which every individual life form is different, so we create simple boxes to understand MOST, but not all, of life.

but nature doesn't care about or observe human's simplistic models. it just does what it does, leaving humans to keep improving our understandings to better reflect reality.


a few things he mentioned:

humans aren't just XX or XY, there's also X, XXX, and XXY.

some species have both male and female parts (flowers have both stamen and pistil!)

some species can change sex (some frog species -- if there are "too many" of one sex, some will simply change to the opposite sex!)

homosexuality and bisexuality is in many species as well.

all fetuses start development as female, and many things have to happen in order for a baby to be born expressing maleness. it isn't just a matter of having XY chromosomes. for various reasons, a fetus may not produce enough, or any, testosterone. alternatively, the receptors may not process the testosterone, at least in certain organs. so the fetus just continues to express femaleness, notwithstanding the XY chromosomes.

then there are also chimeras -- an embryo can absorb a twin early in development. sometimes, one is XX and the other is XY, which can result in some organs being female/XX and others male/XY in the same person.


again, nature does what it does, and humans struggle to comprehend. in the process, we make simplifications, and idiots get upset when confronted with the reality that their simplification doesn't handle 100% of all the cases.

[jfz9580m]

12. I have never understood homo/transphobia

From the time I first became aware of the existence of anything different from cis-heterosexuality, I just assumed it is a natural part of the spectrum of human sexuality/orientation.

My guess is it’s religion. I grew up free of religious brainwashing or much conservative dogma.

Maybe this is not very pc. But I have generally had a pro-LGBT bias. It takes courage to be yourself in a society that is so judgemental.

The LGBT community is also less judgemental of my own childless catlady lifestyle and unconventional choices..it has often seemed like a natural allyship 😸.

[TommyT139]

14. It's not religion

It's not religion, but religion - like many human-run institutions - is a perfect vehicle for hatred...as well as love and acceptance.

For instance, mainline Christian denominations in the US are supportive of trans people. Other traditions are too, although currently there are fewer openly trans Muslims and Latter-Day Saints. The Episcopal Church, as a great example, voted years ago to not only support trans employees with full health insurance, but theologically, to welcome the vocations of trans people up to and including the office of bishop.

[jfz9580m]

15. Interesting

Thanks for the feedback . Good to know the Episcopal church is liberal in this regard.

I didn’t mean milder forms of faith. It does seem hard to argue though that a lot of the bigotry doesn’t have religious roots.
It is also a manosphere/incel phenomenon in recent years.

[TommyT139]

17. You're welcome

And to be clear, see the "human run institutions" part above. Some of it is polity -- the "rulebook" for how a denomination is run. The Ep Ch gives a lot of authority to bishops, so a progressive bishop can accomplish a lot. At the parish level, it of course varies widely. But it is a very very important witness to hold up -- that some of the institutions which are used as cudgels are able to change and grow.

[jfz9580m]

20. Understood

But it is a very very important witness to hold up -- that some of the institutions which are used as cudgels are able to change and grow.

A vital part of real change..

[AZSkiffyGeek]

24. The Episcopalians are actually participating in the Phoenix Pride Parade and Festival this weekend NT

[jfz9580m]

25. Thanks for the info

Well you and TommyT139 have definitely improved my opinion of the Episcopal Church significantly.

Apparently they have relatively progressive views on abortion access as well:

https://episcopalnewsservice.org/2023/01/20/amid-post-roe-restrictions-on-abortion-church-webinar-highlights-faith-based-advocacy-for-reproductive-rights/

I am an atheist, but I have zero problem with more broad-minded and humane approaches to faith like this.

Also congratulations on coming out AZSkiffyGeek. I hope your family comes around :-/.

[TommyT139]

27. Happy Pride! 🏳️‍⚧️🏳️‍🌈🎉

[Bernardo de La Paz]

23. Not religion. Big Religion exploits it. Kids pick it up from parents & social influences ("media") . . . . nt