Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News Editorials & Other Articles General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

guillaumeb

(42,649 posts)
Wed Oct 2, 2019, 11:32 AM Oct 2019

Who Is Affected by the Dunning-Kruger Effect?

From the article:

So, who is affected by the Dunning-Kruger effect? Unfortunately, we all are. This is because no matter how informed or experienced we are, everyone has areas in which they are uninformed and incompetent. You might be smart and skilled in many areas, but no one is an expert at everything.


To read more:

https://www.verywellmind.com/an-overview-of-the-dunning-kruger-effect-4160740

Often people make overly broad statements, especially regarding religion and theists. But those making these statements generally demonstrate the Dunning-Kruger effect in action rather than make any relevant observation about religion or theists.
49 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Who Is Affected by the Dunning-Kruger Effect? (Original Post) guillaumeb Oct 2019 OP
This is not only an interesting effect (and article) FM123 Oct 2019 #1
I am an expert in nothing, but even experts in something are not experts in everything. guillaumeb Oct 2019 #3
It is such a fascinating subject! FM123 Oct 2019 #4
Look at Ben Carson. guillaumeb Oct 2019 #6
No shortage of good examples running around pandr32 Oct 2019 #2
True. I am also guilty of it at times. guillaumeb Oct 2019 #5
"His base" is a prime example of this effect RainCaster Oct 2019 #7
How insulting edhopper Oct 2019 #8
And that's exactly the point. trotsky Oct 2019 #10
Off topic. guillaumeb Oct 2019 #16
No the reason for the OP is to stifle criticism of religion wasupaloopa Oct 2019 #28
We will agree to disagree. guillaumeb Oct 2019 #30
That makes sense. Sorry wasupaloopa Oct 2019 #31
Not a problem. guillaumeb Oct 2019 #32
The topic is exorcism. Voltaire2 Oct 2019 #36
On the contrary, it's your key topic, as anyone can plainly see. trotsky Oct 2019 #41
At least you demonstrated something. guillaumeb Oct 2019 #47
So predictable. trotsky Oct 2019 #48
Well..... guillaumeb Oct 2019 #15
It appears edhopper Oct 2019 #19
Then you explain it to me. guillaumeb Oct 2019 #20
Because you believe in a sky daddy,, Eko Oct 2019 #39
Oh man, when this thread started, I thought you understood how DK effect worked. Silly me. AtheistCrusader Oct 2019 #45
So why not just reply to the original post about this? Cuthbert Allgood Oct 2019 #9
Certainly not you. Act_of_Reparation Oct 2019 #11
#5 guillaumeb Oct 2019 #17
"at times" trotsky Oct 2019 #43
Case in point: Voltaire2 Oct 2019 #12
LOL n/t trotsky Oct 2019 #13
LMAO! NeoGreen Oct 2019 #14
Are you exempt from Dunning-Kruger guillaumeb Oct 2019 #18
what about the exorcism in arizona where a man killed his son Voltaire2 Oct 2019 #21
Are you exempt from employing whataboutism? eom guillaumeb Oct 2019 #22
What about the report of systemic abuse in the Diocese of Tulsa that was just released yesterday? Act_of_Reparation Oct 2019 #40
Sometimes you have to wonder if he's trying to be a parody of himself Major Nikon Oct 2019 #33
from the article edhopper Oct 2019 #23
From the excerpt: guillaumeb Oct 2019 #24
Of course we are edhopper Oct 2019 #25
OK. guillaumeb Oct 2019 #26
What claim? edhopper Oct 2019 #38
Many of us here were raised in a religious home. wasupaloopa Oct 2019 #27
True, as can I, guillaumeb Oct 2019 #29
It should be viewed more like... NeoGreen Oct 2019 #34
Thank you for that demonstration. eom guillaumeb Oct 2019 #35
"Demonstration"?...are you... NeoGreen Oct 2019 #37
But that's NOT what the DK effect is. Cuthbert Allgood Oct 2019 #42
Yeah, that's why atheists consistently score more knowledgable about religion, than theists. AtheistCrusader Oct 2019 #44
Interesting... NeoGreen Oct 2019 #46
hmmm I think.. uriel1972 Oct 2019 #49

FM123

(10,130 posts)
1. This is not only an interesting effect (and article)
Wed Oct 2, 2019, 11:37 AM
Oct 2019

but what a coincidence - I was just watching a tv show called "Adam Ruins Everything" (episode: Adam Ruins Himself) with my kid and they were discussing this very effect...

guillaumeb

(42,649 posts)
3. I am an expert in nothing, but even experts in something are not experts in everything.
Wed Oct 2, 2019, 11:40 AM
Oct 2019

Mia also posted an article on this earlier.

guillaumeb

(42,649 posts)
5. True. I am also guilty of it at times.
Wed Oct 2, 2019, 11:42 AM
Oct 2019

But that also might be generalized presumption of competence by a male.

edhopper

(34,995 posts)
8. How insulting
Wed Oct 2, 2019, 11:56 AM
Oct 2019

to people who disagree with you.

"But those making these statements generally demonstrate the Dunning-Kruger effect"

Not sometimes, not once in a while, but "generally", which implies mostly.

Sorry, but people who comment on your posts are as well informed as they seem to be.


trotsky

(49,533 posts)
10. And that's exactly the point.
Wed Oct 2, 2019, 01:01 PM
Oct 2019

Most of what guillaumeb has to say in this forum comes back to one simple thought: "Non-believers need to stop criticizing religion."

He's discovered a shiny new toy that he thinks will assist in his quest to silence that criticism (to him, Dunning-Kruger means that all non-believers are too stupid/ignorant about religion to be able to criticize it), and so he started a new thread to highlight it.

guillaumeb

(42,649 posts)
16. Off topic.
Wed Oct 2, 2019, 04:52 PM
Oct 2019

The topic is Dunning-Kruger. Are you immune from the effects?

So, who is affected by the Dunning-Kruger effect? Unfortunately, we all are. This is because no matter how informed or experienced we are, everyone has areas in which they are uninformed and incompetent. You might be smart and skilled in many areas, but no one is an expert at everything.

guillaumeb

(42,649 posts)
32. Not a problem.
Wed Oct 2, 2019, 07:02 PM
Oct 2019

On another topic, we can all watch the Trump Administration's slow implosion from the weight of all of those lies and crimes.

trotsky

(49,533 posts)
41. On the contrary, it's your key topic, as anyone can plainly see.
Thu Oct 3, 2019, 08:19 AM
Oct 2019

You want to stifle the viewpoints of non-believers, and you'll use anything to do it.

I am immune to Dunning-Kruger when it comes to theology, because there is no way to verify that a theist such as yourself knows more about gods than I do.

trotsky

(49,533 posts)
48. So predictable.
Thu Oct 3, 2019, 02:45 PM
Oct 2019

Faced with facts you can't counter, you retreat to accusations of "narratives."

I prefer to let people judge you themselves, and decide if it's my "narrative" or the truth.

guillaumeb

(42,649 posts)
15. Well.....
Wed Oct 2, 2019, 04:51 PM
Oct 2019

So, who is affected by the Dunning-Kruger effect? Unfortunately, we all are. This is because no matter how informed or experienced we are, everyone has areas in which they are uninformed and incompetent. You might be smart and skilled in many areas, but no one is an expert at everything.

edhopper

(34,995 posts)
19. It appears
Wed Oct 2, 2019, 04:57 PM
Oct 2019

you don't understand the DK effect. In fact i would say your use of it here is a perfect illustration of it.

guillaumeb

(42,649 posts)
20. Then you explain it to me.
Wed Oct 2, 2019, 05:01 PM
Oct 2019

And, explain how anyone mocking theists as delusional is not exemplifying Dunning-Kruger by making an unprovable claim while assuming that they are competent to do so.

Eko

(8,568 posts)
39. Because you believe in a sky daddy,,
Wed Oct 2, 2019, 09:57 PM
Oct 2019

Last edited Wed Oct 2, 2019, 10:27 PM - Edit history (1)

You believe in a sky daddy. You are dunning-Kruger. You say something is true without any proof and you know it is true. You know how we all got here, how the universe got here, what we are supposed to do, where we are going, and what happens to us when we die. You know everything and yet know nothing. That is Dunning-Kruger in a nutshell.

AtheistCrusader

(33,982 posts)
45. Oh man, when this thread started, I thought you understood how DK effect worked. Silly me.
Thu Oct 3, 2019, 10:51 AM
Oct 2019

You are committing a formal fallacy. More than one, actually.

It does not follow that claiming theists are delusional is unprovable.
Delusion, in common parlance, is a spectrum that does not imply or require a psychological diagnosis like this one https://www.mdpi.com/1010-660X/44/7/529 . And if you want to talk about unprovability, the person who claims theism is correct/adheres to it, is AT LEAST on as shaky ground as the person suggesting theism might be a delusion. Because theists of different sects can't even prove the reality of their theistic beliefs to each other.

It also does not follow that everyone who makes that claim, is not competent to make the claim.

Cuthbert Allgood

(5,187 posts)
9. So why not just reply to the original post about this?
Wed Oct 2, 2019, 12:32 PM
Oct 2019

Kind of an all about me thing.

But as to your point, you, once again, fail to apply things correctly. I am no longer shocked

guillaumeb

(42,649 posts)
17. #5
Wed Oct 2, 2019, 04:53 PM
Oct 2019

5. True. I am also guilty of it at times.

But that also might be generalized presumption of competence by a male.

Voltaire2

(14,795 posts)
12. Case in point:
Wed Oct 2, 2019, 01:52 PM
Oct 2019

Often people make overly broad statements, especially regarding religion and theists. But those making these statements generally demonstrate the Dunning-Kruger effect in action rather than make any relevant observation about religion or theists.

edhopper

(34,995 posts)
23. from the article
Wed Oct 2, 2019, 05:29 PM
Oct 2019
Essentially, low ability people do not possess the skills needed to recognize their own incompetence. The combination of poor self-awareness and low cognitive ability leads them to overestimate their own capabilities.


Most smart people are aware of the areas in which they are deficient. The DK effect does not apply to everyone.

Hope that explains where you went astray here.

guillaumeb

(42,649 posts)
24. From the excerpt:
Wed Oct 2, 2019, 05:39 PM
Oct 2019
So, who is affected by the Dunning-Kruger effect?

Unfortunately, we all are.

This is because no matter how informed or experienced we are, everyone has areas in which they are uninformed and incompetent. You might be smart and skilled in many areas, but no one is an expert at everything.





Again,

Unfortunately, we all are.

edhopper

(34,995 posts)
25. Of course we are
Wed Oct 2, 2019, 05:56 PM
Oct 2019

but the DK effect is specifically about people who don't know that they are uninformed.

Most of us understand that we are, and therefore the DK effect is not pertinent.

I am letting you know you are mistaken about how you are applying it here. You can go on showing you are uninformed and try to show you know something you don't (that is the DK effect), or accept your lack of knowledge in this area.

guillaumeb

(42,649 posts)
26. OK.
Wed Oct 2, 2019, 05:57 PM
Oct 2019

And you did actually say:

Most smart people are aware of the areas in which they are deficient. The DK effect does not apply to everyone.

Hope that explains where you went astray here.


So are you now retracting your earlier claim?

edhopper

(34,995 posts)
38. What claim?
Wed Oct 2, 2019, 08:21 PM
Oct 2019

The DK effect is not about being uniformed or incompent in some area. It's about those who think they are becasue they are too ignorant or unintelligent to know they aren't

 

wasupaloopa

(4,516 posts)
27. Many of us here were raised in a religious home.
Wed Oct 2, 2019, 06:31 PM
Oct 2019

I was raised a Catholic though I never believed the church’s teachings.

My brother is a Catholic priest, not the alter boy fucker type. He was once married and has two kids.

I know about being a Catholic.

I can talk about it.

guillaumeb

(42,649 posts)
29. True, as can I,
Wed Oct 2, 2019, 06:36 PM
Oct 2019

but I was referring here to anyone making overly broad statements about theism and theists. Statements that equate theism with delusion, for example.

NeoGreen

(4,033 posts)
34. It should be viewed more like...
Wed Oct 2, 2019, 07:39 PM
Oct 2019

...an infection.

One with a great support apparatus and that people are constantly re-exposed to, to keep it viable.

Cuthbert Allgood

(5,187 posts)
42. But that's NOT what the DK effect is.
Thu Oct 3, 2019, 08:37 AM
Oct 2019

It isn't about making overly broad statements. That would be a fallacy, not DK.

I have spent thousands of ours studying Catholicism. Just because I'm not a theist at this moment does not mean that I am uneducated. Many here have similar experiences.

Stop trying to jam everyone you disagree with into some silly label.

NeoGreen

(4,033 posts)
46. Interesting...
Thu Oct 3, 2019, 10:57 AM
Oct 2019

...
https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/unique-everybody-else/201401/more-knowledge-less-belief-in-religion


Alternatively, it may be that people who have a particular thirst for knowledge find religious belief incompatible with their natural curiosity. Recently, Pope Francis actually stated that “the spirit of curiosity distances one from God.” Many atheists and agnostics may well agree.


I'm a bit, just a bit, flabbergasted to find a quote from Mr. Bergoglio that includes the words 'curiosity' and 'god' that I find myself in agreement.
Latest Discussions»Issue Forums»Religion»Who Is Affected by the Du...