2016 Postmortem

JHan

(10,173 posts)

144. I'll share this post again..

Fri Nov 25, 2016, 11:19 AM

Nov 2016

As I said in my other post to you, I acknowledge the failings in the midwest..

.. The larger argument is that the country is divided and not necessarily because of economic reasons.

A significant number of Trump supporters make above 60k a year. Struggling urbanites making less than 50k voted Clinton. Clinton also didn't do too shabby among rural voters last I checked.

The problem with Clinton was the arrogance of her campaign towards the midwest - her campaign manager ignored Bill's sage advice to stay in the midwest and push hard for those extra votes. Bill's political instincts are sharper and better than hillary's and all her advisors combined, but this does not mean that the nation rejected Hillary and embraced Trump and his economic message.

Most Americans clearly saw through the bullshit.

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So is our message really that all Trump voters are racist and that's why we lost? [View all] realmirage Nov 2016 OP

Our most pressing message is RUSSIA Madam45for2923 Nov 2016 #1

Yup, I have a feeling that between Russia and the FBI, a coup has taken place. shraby Nov 2016 #4

Yup, I have a feeling that between Russia and the FBI, a coup has taken place. LenaBaby61 Nov 2016 #10

I wish I didn't agree....but I do... pangaia Nov 2016 #63

Yup, count me in. InAbLuEsTaTe Nov 2016 #110

In theory, but Cosmocat Nov 2016 #66

Russia is the scapegoat? How pathetic. jfern Nov 2016 #156

? Russia hacked the DNC and Hill's emails, so says 17 intel and security agencies wordpix Nov 2016 #158

Hillary caused Hillary to lose, not Russia. jfern Nov 2016 #159

No blue cat Nov 2016 #2

Geesh & F*ck! Madam45for2923 Nov 2016 #5

I live in Alabama. yallerdawg Nov 2016 #69

I would say the two main things that lost the election was the two doc03 Nov 2016 #3

Yep hueymahl Nov 2016 #90

I agree they were big factors. OnionPatch Nov 2016 #145

Well they did vote for someone who spouted some divisive shit all year didn't they? JHan Nov 2016 #6

Hillary's message to them was globalism, which is what they hate realmirage Nov 2016 #11

Between her and Sanders and Trump she was the only one who intuitively knew the challenges ahead.. JHan Nov 2016 #18

"Retraining" for nonexistent jobs likely to be globalized or flooded into wage crashing/criteria TheKentuckian Nov 2016 #154

Hold on.. JHan Nov 2016 #155

No, the current message SickOfTheOnePct Nov 2016 #7

So basically what the republicans were planning to do realmirage Nov 2016 #12

Hello Republican super majority. Ace Rothstein Nov 2016 #15

lolz realmirage Nov 2016 #107

Which better change... TCJ70 Nov 2016 #64

Political Russian roulette, but you may be right. Yo_Mama Nov 2016 #149

I think it has to be a three-pronged approach SickOfTheOnePct Nov 2016 #150

No... SidDithers Nov 2016 #8

Agree 100% n/t SickOfTheOnePct Nov 2016 #9

In reality, people care about their economic survival before realmirage Nov 2016 #14

Not all people. hamsterjill Nov 2016 #84

You must be well off to have such a luxury realmirage Nov 2016 #108

No, I am not well off. hamsterjill Nov 2016 #137

Those people didn't care enough about their economic survival to listen long enough to find out Squinch Nov 2016 #87

So tell me what the Democrats' plan was to help people in the rust belt? realmirage Nov 2016 #109

You can't look at Hillary's site either? Are your fingers broken? For people who are Squinch Nov 2016 #134

A 15.00 an hour minimum wage .... dawg Nov 2016 #138

Completely wrong. Most of it is not concious choice. Your comment is what's wrong with Democrats KittyWampus Nov 2016 #168

Racist AND misogynistic. SMC22307 Nov 2016 #13

Not That Simple PoorMonger Nov 2016 #16

They used to have thriving communities realmirage Nov 2016 #17

Couldn't agree more n/t SickOfTheOnePct Nov 2016 #19

Trump wasn't listening to them. He was pandering to them. TwilightZone Nov 2016 #25

Of course he listened realmirage Nov 2016 #27

There are a multitude of reasons why he won. TwilightZone Nov 2016 #28

The rust belt flipped red realmirage Nov 2016 #30

And what jobs plan ... LenaBaby61 Nov 2016 #37

He buys his steel and other things from China because realmirage Nov 2016 #49

No.. no ... no....he can buy steel in the US and not for twice its price. He buys steel in uponit7771 Nov 2016 #116

It is a little difficult when we are held to an entirely different standard. AgadorSparticus Nov 2016 #81

Trump lied to them. When NAFTA and TPP are gone, their lives are not going to get any Squinch Nov 2016 #89

No ... They're not all racist... They do support a racist with their votes and that's bad enough uponit7771 Nov 2016 #20

They voted for economic survival realmirage Nov 2016 #23

Plenty are racist pieces of shit...don't kid yourself. Demsrule86 Nov 2016 #33

Racists have always existed, but that's not why they flipped red realmirage Nov 2016 #36

With a 4.9% he rate and even lower in the lost HRC projected states? The jobless uponit7771 Nov 2016 #40

The jobless rate is misinterpreted realmirage Nov 2016 #51

This is false on its face ... Waco link inside... Its a rwtp.. I wish we wouldn't repeat it uponit7771 Nov 2016 #56

Have you been to Michigan lately? realmirage Nov 2016 #60

Michigan's UE rate is 5.4% and the same can be said about towns in CA uponit7771 Nov 2016 #65

"As if it's worse now." Exactly. This is nuts. Squinch Nov 2016 #92

take a look realmirage Nov 2016 #99

article doesn't address the question about jobs in those areas then and now... if they're ... uponit7771 Nov 2016 #112

So we are in the minority in realmirage Nov 2016 #113

We're in the minority in the house because of gerrymandering, that's a known knowm... we're uponit7771 Nov 2016 #114

exit polls? realmirage Nov 2016 #117

No but exit polls and 95% of the generational polling science being wrong something fucked uponit7771 Nov 2016 #120

Please tell... HDSam Nov 2016 #123

A rising LFPR, that's how I'm hedging the "jobs less recovery" MSM meme... Labor Force uponit7771 Nov 2016 #125

I've been to Michigan gollygee Nov 2016 #78

This is worth considering realmirage Nov 2016 #100

Thank you for this, this is my theory also... that the rural towns are doing better economically uponit7771 Nov 2016 #124

Ugh. This bullshit again. Squinch Nov 2016 #93

you mean this bullshit? realmirage Nov 2016 #101

No, the bullshit you talked about in the above post of your gish gallop. But this is bullshit too. Squinch Nov 2016 #133

Yes, people voted for donald fucking trump Cosmocat Nov 2016 #67

The Democratic Party's message just failed, maybe you should be asking why realmirage Nov 2016 #103

Obviously they didn't because they voted for the candidate who has no prospect of improving Squinch Nov 2016 #91

They voted for an economic delusion using racist language. Coventina Nov 2016 #102

Riiight... realmirage Nov 2016 #104

Donald Trump is a naked racist endorsed by the KKK. Coventina Nov 2016 #105

No, people vote their interests realmirage Nov 2016 #106

"bathrooms" being their interest then the DNC isn't going to reach them at all... they're ecomically uponit7771 Nov 2016 #127

Riiiiiight. Sunshine and lollipops being sold in the form of calling others rapists, murderers, Coventina Nov 2016 #129

I'd like to see this, if their lives are that much worse now than BEFORE Obama then you have a point uponit7771 Nov 2016 #118

What? They've been blue for a long time.. And you say just consider them lost forever? realmirage Nov 2016 #119

The flip counties have NOT been blue for a long time unless you're counting Obama as "long time" uponit7771 Nov 2016 #122

They Voted For RobinA Nov 2016 #163

Perhaps not. BlueStater Nov 2016 #21

Also melman Nov 2016 #22

That's the path to oblivion for the Party. realmirage Nov 2016 #24

I know melman Nov 2016 #29

Not all Trump voters are racists. RandySF Nov 2016 #26

I have to say that I disagree. If they are willing to give his racism a pass because of some other Squinch Nov 2016 #94

No, they're stupid too. MadamPresident Nov 2016 #31

No, they're stupid too. LenaBaby61 Nov 2016 #39

In my opinion it may not be wise to call union voters who deserted ... spin Nov 2016 #75

precisely realmirage Nov 2016 #111

I agree. OhioBlue Nov 2016 #121

As a union worker I can attest to the stupidity. MadamPresident Nov 2016 #136

Welcome to DU by the way. ... spin Nov 2016 #151

Couldn't Agree More RobinA Nov 2016 #164

Welcome, welcome, and fabulous post. Squinch Nov 2016 #95

I would say most Trump supporters are racist Demsrule86 Nov 2016 #32

I know people who definitely could be called racist. ... spin Nov 2016 #77

yes! Top DEMS in Ohio have campaigned against trade deals for years OhioBlue Nov 2016 #126

I grew up in Ohio but joined the Air Force back in the 1960s. ... spin Nov 2016 #130

It's a reason, but not important Bradical79 Nov 2016 #34

It is incredibly easy to get people to turn on each other. alarimer Nov 2016 #80

From what I've seen no duncang Nov 2016 #35

but we shouldnt treat getting duped by racists as indelible moral stain Bucky Nov 2016 #44

Trump told liquid diamond Nov 2016 #38

You mean we shouldn't try to address unemployment in the rust belt? realmirage Nov 2016 #41

People who think all Trump voters are racists are not thinking clearly Bucky Nov 2016 #43

It's a waste of time. liquid diamond Nov 2016 #45

So losing again is your strategy? realmirage Nov 2016 #48

That's what you got from that post? Sounds like a shit reading. Squinch Nov 2016 #96

No, that would be a dumb, hopeless message Bucky Nov 2016 #42

This is the message of most of the "elites" on this site. I think the Democratic party jack_krass Nov 2016 #46

I hate to admit it but the elitist label realmirage Nov 2016 #52

Is that your takeaway from this RIGGED election? Hekate Nov 2016 #47

You didn't read the whole op did you... realmirage Nov 2016 #53

binary thinking is stinking thinking, and you are letting LaydeeBug Nov 2016 #50

So your strategy realmirage Nov 2016 #55

again, the binary, either this or that, is YOUR fallacy, not mine. nt LaydeeBug Nov 2016 #58

Yep- every person positing this let's cater to the rust belt is ignoring a hell of a lot.... bettyellen Nov 2016 #76

I know, right? From bathrooms to bimbos...it never ends. nt LaydeeBug Nov 2016 #79

Again, that's what you got from that post? You keep putting words in people's mouths that are not Squinch Nov 2016 #97

Thank you. emulatorloo Nov 2016 #72

I hope not Lotusflower70 Nov 2016 #54

Well said. We have to learn from this. realmirage Nov 2016 #57

most of them are racist and all give racism a pass JI7 Nov 2016 #59

'Our' message seems to be all over the map, elleng Nov 2016 #61

Clinton lost because Clinton forgot ... earthside Nov 2016 #62

And yet.. JHan Nov 2016 #74

It's pretty elemental politics. earthside Nov 2016 #139

You can't convince me that her message didn't pierce through to people.. JHan Nov 2016 #140

She lost where it mattered. earthside Nov 2016 #143

I'll share this post again.. JHan Nov 2016 #144

Right to the nub of the matter. earthside Nov 2016 #147

We can also add.. JHan Nov 2016 #148

People are trying to work up a narrative around the narrowest of victories for Trump in the midwest. JHan Nov 2016 #141

I don't know about "ours" but mine? yeah-sexist and racist ismnotwasm Nov 2016 #68

Yes treestar Nov 2016 #70

Hyperbolic mischaracterization. emulatorloo Nov 2016 #71

Who is this "our" you speak of? Lil Missy Nov 2016 #73

You nailed it. It is a strawman argument. emulatorloo Nov 2016 #86

Putting words in the mouths of others that others never said seems to be a talent with this one. Squinch Nov 2016 #98

The electoral college does not take away their vote or diminish them. musicblind Nov 2016 #82

In my book anyone who votes for a racist, is a racist. 50 Shades Of Blue Nov 2016 #83

All Trump voters are either racist, misogynist or both. They deserve the KingCharlemagne Nov 2016 #85

Thank you for your post hueymahl Nov 2016 #88

The type of ignorance that causes a person Lint Head Nov 2016 #115

They are all willing to vote for a man who blatantly pushed racist and sexist pnwmom Nov 2016 #128

No, not all were... Mike Nelson Nov 2016 #131

I do feel for those in the rust belt. MyNameGoesHere Nov 2016 #132

Electing Chuck Shumer as our new party Leader is not a good sign quantumjunkie Nov 2016 #135

"Economic survival" is why they voted for Obama who saved their bacon. ucrdem Nov 2016 #142

Agree - no matter how people feel, this approach is self-defeating. Yo_Mama Nov 2016 #146

I'm glad that there are people out there that can still see past their emotions realmirage Nov 2016 #152

Don't Disagree RobinA Nov 2016 #165

"Social issues"? Lizz612 Nov 2016 #153

no - message is "election integrity" and "voter solutions" wordpix Nov 2016 #157

Except For The Fact RobinA Nov 2016 #160

At the bare minimum, they saw all the racist shit, and decided they could tolerate it. backscatter712 Nov 2016 #161

1000, "and decided they could tolerate it." uponit7771 Nov 2016 #162

Include the points raised in this article in any proposed solution BSdetect Nov 2016 #166

If that is what was learned by the 2016 election, the Democratic party has underestimated the scope PufPuf23 Nov 2016 #167